5 replies to this topic

[Level 99]

Tis a sad state of affairs we live in these days.

I know one of the musicians who had worked progressively on the SoRR project. This latest release was the icing on their cake for so many years of hard work: Version 5 had it all, including levels from all 3 SoR games rolled into one, every character, every enemey, every song, all revamped and upgraded for today. It is a fantastic game, and it is absolutely perfect to play with friends and relive the glory days of the side-scrollin' beat-'em-up! "The goal of the project was to create a seamless narrative between all three Streets of Rage games, and SORR V5 contained over 100 total levels based on every known version of Streets of Rage. The game also featured a number of enhancements, including 83 remixed and remastered music tracks, 19 playable characters, and 64 different types of enemies. "

And then this happened:

http://www.tssznews....of-rage-remake/

Sega, which apparently had no problems with the game during its creation and release, decided that it had changed its mind the moment it saw just how awesome the game was. Maybe it was jealous, or maybe it was the fact that they had planned on releasing SoR2 on iOS shortly:

http://www.destructo...ay-198834.phtml

And then this statement was issued just a few days ago:

http://kotaku.com/#!5791059/fan+made-s...quest-from-sega

Brace yourselves for the official text below:

Sega Europe reps responded with the following statement: "SEGA is committed to supporting any fans that take an interest in our games, and where possible we do so by involving them in Beta tests and other development, marketing or research opportunities. However we need to protect our intellectual property rights and this may result in us requesting that our fans remove online imagery, videos or games in some instances."

So basically, if you make something that outshines the official Sega product or infringes on any future plans Sega has to rape a dead or inept franchise, look out for a C&D.

I have to say that, as a video game music arrange AND the head of the Lucid Dreaming project, I am shocked and disgusted. Valve or even Microsoft Games would have looked at these talented folks and asked them to be brought on board and work on actual products for the company. Sega tells them to take it down so they can re-release the same poorly-emulated console version one more time, for another $3 dollars. It has me somewhat spooked too, specifically because OC ReMix has never had any issues with game companies but a response like that one brings the lines dangerously close. There was no mention of audio in their official statement, but it isn't hard to see how that could easily be slipped in.

Fans keep these old franchises alive, sometimes infusing things with fresh blood. What Sega did here was not only a poor decision: it was outright unfair.

SoRR is still very easily available on the internet if you look hard enough (read: megaupload, rapidshare, forum links, private FTP hosting, torrenting, etc.), so I highly encourage any and all of you who like SoR to go check out Streets of Rage Remake. It is definitely better than any other crappy port of the Genesis version.

[Nemoide]

I sympathize with the fans who made this as an expression of love for a classic game series.

However, Streets of Rage is still a Sega trademark and a copyrighted game; I'm no lawyer, but I'm pretty sure that for them to continue to hold on to intellectual property rights, they are required to send cease & desist orders to people who are infringing. While most fan-projects are fine, making GAMES that are directly homaging or "ripping off" another GAME is a legal no-no. If they allowed the game to exist, they could lose their copyright/trademark claim. Since the Streets of Rage games are still being sold as downloads, Sega doesn't want to lose them. I could be mistaken on this, but that's how it was explained when I was a member of an official game company forums when they issued some C&D orders.

Obviously, it's a slippery slope. Why was SoRR forced down while countless Sonic fangames exist? Maybe because most of those Sonic games aren't seen as potential competition. Why was SoRR canned after it was finished, even though Sega had been aware of it from early stages? Maybe they were afraid of having a product of equal/higher caliber competing on the market. Whatever the reason, I think a copyright-holder is within their right to tell other groups making a product with the same name, art, and mechanics to stop. I do think it was a jerk move but IMO it's hardly "outright unfair."

I think non-game fan projects are still safe, since they won't in any way interfere with the sales of Sega products; the effect on sails is the de facto most important factor in copyright/fair use. Sega's in the game business, not the music business; even though they make soundtrack CDs, those tend to be limited and more promotional merchandise than a core product the way games are. Sonic 2 HD, on the other hand could be in danger...

So yeah! I feel like I've got to be a little argumentative; it's my information scientist training! I hope I don't sound too much like a stuffy geriatric republican. I certainly don't mean any offense on the people who made the game or their supporters, I just think Sega's move makes a fair amount of sense.

[Level 99]

I sympathize with the fans who made this as an expression of love for a classic game series.

However, Streets of Rage is still a Sega trademark and a copyrighted game; I'm no lawyer, but I'm pretty sure that for them to continue to hold on to intellectual property rights, they are required to send cease & desist orders to people who are infringing. While most fan-projects are fine, making GAMES that are directly homaging or "ripping off" another GAME is a legal no-no. If they allowed the game to exist, they could lose their copyright/trademark claim. Since the Streets of Rage games are still being sold as downloads, Sega doesn't want to lose them. I could be mistaken on this, but that's how it was explained when I was a member of an official game company forums when they issued some C&D orders.

Obviously, it's a slippery slope. Why was SoRR forced down while countless Sonic fangames exist? Maybe because most of those Sonic games aren't seen as potential competition. Why was SoRR canned after it was finished, even though Sega had been aware of it from early stages? Maybe they were afraid of having a product of equal/higher caliber competing on the market. Whatever the reason, I think a copyright-holder is within their right to tell other groups making a product with the same name, art, and mechanics to stop. I do think it was a jerk move but IMO it's hardly "outright unfair."

I think non-game fan projects are still safe, since they won't in any way interfere with the sales of Sega products; the effect on sails is the de facto most important factor in copyright/fair use. Sega's in the game business, not the music business; even though they make soundtrack CDs, those tend to be limited and more promotional merchandise than a core product the way games are.

So yeah! I feel like I've got to be a little argumentative; it's my information scientist training! I hope I don't sound too much like a stuffy geriatric republican. I certainly don't mean any offense on the people who made the game or their supporters, I just think Sega's move makes a fair amount of sense.

Heh no, I totally understand the point of view, and I take no offense (and I'm sure none of the creators do either) to your position. It is a legit and, in this case, legally correct position. The reason I say it is outright unfair was that, according to the game's developers, Sega had been aware of this every step of the way, up through and including the release earlier this month. Giving them the false impression of safety for about 8 years of game development, just to have it C&D'd within about a week of availability is what I feel is outright unfair.

Sega has every right to protect its IP, that much is true. When fan games like Sonic Fan Remix, Sonic 2 HD, and SoRR start to come out and outshine the original product, I feel that in that case the effort should be rewarded instead of punished. Valve bought Counterstrike and Team Fortress along with the teams that made them, not to mention the majority of the team that made Portal from an earlier indie game based on a similar premise. I don't see why Sega wouldn't make them an offer and please the fans as well as save face, instead of looking like a heartless corporation that is only interested in $$$.

The way Sega's business practices have been as of late echo the sentiment of Activision: come out with the same thing, or incrimental increases, year after year, and charge for it all. While Sega's approach is much more rooted into nostalgia, it is the same philosophy of running something into the ground until it is no longer profitable. This doesn't make sense from a business perspective because while the idea of following the diminishing returns curve seems okay if you have 50 product lines, it doesn't make sense in the long term. Direct comparison: Activision ran Guitar Hero, Tony Hawk, and is currently running Call of Duty, into the ground. Sega has run other franchises into the ground through progressive re-release of the same original games in compilation packs on every system imaginable, and it doesn't see any reason to put any extra effort into them. Once a game is seen as no longer profitable, it is relegated to compilation packs and re-releases.

While legally, yes, Sega was in their right, every aspect of their choice and business operating practice is flawed from both a moral AND a long-term financial perspective. I still remember when Sega bought that one Saturn emulator for use for its own self-run game internet delivery service and internal development use. That is the kind of smart decision that I'm thinking of when I say I am shocked about what has happened here.

Edit: PS. this is a healthy argumentative situation, which I absolutely enjoy because in the end, we both end up the wiser. and it is very nice to have an intelligent and verbose person making counter-points! Let us continue!

[Zero-Shift]

I don't see why Sega wouldn't make them an offer and please the fans as well as save face, instead of looking like a heartless corporation that is only interested in $$$.

It's Sega. Nuff said. I understand they were in their legal rights to end a C&D but like you said, it's BS they let it go so far.

Honestly, this just seems like par for the course behavior for them. It's been like this ever since the Sammy merger it seems, though it feels like it's getting worse. Though the official statement says otherwise I see virtually no commitment at all to their fans or associated products. I suppose I could draw comparisons to Capcom. They may do a lot to make a buck that pisses off people but at the same time they've also shown support for their fans. They work with Udon to bring the Tribute Series artbooks, they worked with OC Remix to make the soundtrack for SSF2T: HD Remix. What has Sega done? They shut down this project and ban people on their Facebook page for mentioning Virtua Fighter 5R.

Way to support the fans guys.

[iLLViLLAiN]

The corporate side of things always ruins the image of the entire company. I can't believe SEGA would do this after letting the countless other fan games go. I wonder what's going to happen when Sonic 2 HD is finally done. They gonna take that down too?

[JaxTH]

Sonic 2 HD is never gonna be finished.