10 replies to this topic

[EZEKiAL]

With two endings, Journey of Dreams brought a lot of questions up. Is Wizeman dead? Is that really NiGHTS up on the BellBridge clock tower? What happened to Reala? If Wizeman is truly dead, doesn't that mean all of the hate, sorrow, and anguish in the world is gone?

First, lets analyze both endings. In the regular ending (achieved by completing one story or not getting higher than a D in every mission), Wizeman says nothing about how destroying him will destroy everything he created, so we can basically assume that without the Ideya of Hope, the Visitors and NiGHTS couldn't do any real damage to him. He simply turns into a ball of light and disappears. Also, notice that he mentions that he can never be destroyed as long as there is darkness in the heart of humans. What exactly does this mean, then, for the True Ending (achieved by getting at least a C in every mission)? Nothing's changed, except now Reala appears to try to stop NiGHTS one last time in another fight. Wizeman, in turn, never says a thing about being invincible as long as darkness exists in the hearts of humans, and instead goes on a rant about how destroying him will kill NiGHTS as well.

Of course, as with most Sonic Team games, plot holes abound.

Question One: Is Wizeman dead?

This of course, is probably the easiest question to answer; the answer to which, is obviously no. Killing Wizeman would assure that NiGHTS and the rest of the Nightmarens, along with Nightmare, would disappear forever, not to mention the world would basically become a fearless place, since Wizeman is the basis of all fear and hatred in the Waking. Without Wizeman, there would be no darkness, and without darkness, there can be no light. The world, in turn, would collapse. So, Wizeman cannot be dead.

Question Two: Is NiGHTS dead?

Again, no. Wizeman wasn't truly destroyed, and thus, NiGHTS wasn't either. I'd say that, perhaps, Wizeman had to absorb all of his creations to regain enough energy to live, and then once he was stable again, released them. But then again, why would he release NiGHTS? This is one of the harder plotholes to fill, but we can basically assume that NiGHTS isn't dead because Wizeman isn't.

Question Three: What happened to Reala?

This is perhaps the BIGGEST plothole of the game. Reala, after his defeat over BellBridge, simply disappears randomly. One can assume that he disappeared when NiGHTS did, but there's also the question of what on Earth happened to him directly after the fight. I'd say that, his pride wounded, Reala simply fled back to Nightmare, but in Video Game terms, Sonic Team was just too lazy to add in a cutscene of him flying away or being like "Argh, NiGHTS, you won."

Question Four: What happened to Will and Helen's parents?!

This is either a massive plothole, a case of child neglect, or we can deduce that the final cutscene of the game is a dream. The lights going out may symbolize the rebirth of Wizeman and the Nightmarens. Also, you'll notice that Will's dad pays no mind to him running off, nor does Helen's mother express concern in a strange boy holding hands with her daughter in the middle of the night. Even little kids can be dangerous, lady...

I'm not saying these are the ABSOLUTE truth, but simply my theory about what happened. I hope you enjoyed it, and I'd love if you'd post your own theories as well.

[Noctourne Wonderland]

Question Three: What happened to Reala?

What happened to any of the maren? Judging by cutscenes, theme seem to just disappear and the reappear in Wizeman's throne room, like when he destroys Donbalon. However, that would have Reala appear there as well, and NiGHTS and the kids get to the throne room very quickly. Logically, Wizey either destroyed or pardoned him before the heroes were in Nightmare. Maybe he went to his area where you fight him in NiD?

Question Four: What happened to Will and Helen's parents?!

Wasn't Helen's mum in the audience? We can guess that Will's dad came down the steps after his son, but then what dud he and the other kids do while Will and Helen had their moment? Just sit there staring?

Anyways, the lights are rather strange, now that i think about it. Maybe Will's dad bumped the power supply while going down he stairs?
I like your idea about it symbolising Wizeman's retun, and the snow is NiGHTS and their willpower.

Finally, perhaps Will and Helen are in the same class, so their parents know each other? However, there are two schools in the bellbridge area judging by Will's game, Red and Blue. That is the same as the uniforms worn in NiD. Claris is in Red, like the kids who beat Elliot, and Elliot is in blue. In we continue that theme, Will and Helen would be from different schools.

[Kentilan]

Yes! Speculation!
Here are my theories and comments:

Question One: Is Wizeman dead?

This of course, is probably the easiest question to answer; the answer to which, is obviously no. Killing Wizeman would assure that NiGHTS and the rest of the Nightmarens, along with Nightmare, would disappear forever, not to mention the world would basically become a fearless place, since Wizeman is the basis of all fear and hatred in the Waking.

I disagree with this statement. Wizeman is the source of the nightmares, not the source of fear, especially not in the waking. People have nightmares because they have fear, not the other way around. Fear can still exist (especially in the waking) without Wizeman.

Now, is Wizeman dead? I have several theories.

1) Yes, they killed him and he's gone for good. If you only take the true ending into account, he said nothing about being immortal.

2) Since Wizeman's speech about being immortal only appeared in the "false" ending, I think that "darkness in the heart of humans" means "missing Ideya". Makes sense as the Ideya are made of light. So, Wizeman will come back as long as they don't have all of their Ideya.
Will and Helen both had all of their Ideya in the true ending, so they destroyed him (and everything he created). But, they only destroyed him in their dreams. Which means WIzeman may still appear in the dreams (or rather, nightmares) of everyone else. Will and Helen will never have nightmares again, but everyone else may until they retrieve all of their Ideya.

3) Wizeman said he couldn't be destroyed "as long as darkness exist in the heart of humans". Which is always the case. But he was defeated. So I think he was temporarily destroyed, but he will come back eventually. Perhaps he will be slowly regenerated by the darkness in people's hearts, or something like that. But when he will be fully regenerated, he will have to recreate everything again, nightmares and nightmarens. NiGHTS will not come back.

Question Two: Is NiGHTS dead?

If Wizeman is dead, then so is NiGHTS. According to my theories above, either NiGHTS has completely disappeared, or he has only disappeared in the dreams of Will and Helen. I think the last scene with NiGHTS on Bellbridge's tower was only symbolic (because he has nothing to do in the real world), something like "NiGHTS will always be in your heart".

Question Three: What happened to Reala?

I think he was knocked unconscious at the end of the fight. Maybe temporarily unconscious, but long enough to reach the ground. Which means he fell from... more than 300 m. Either he died crashing on the ground, or he laid unconscious until Wizeman was destroyed (destroying him as well).

But yes, a proper death scene would have been nice.

Question Four: What happened to Will and Helen's parents?!

This is either a massive plothole, a case of child neglect, or we can deduce that the final cutscene of the game is a dream.

I vote "child neglect".
Will's dad saw Will run down the stairs to catch his ball, so he was simply waiting for him to come back. Helen's mother... she probably didn't think Will would be dangerous... and maybe she was just waiting for Helen to stop being a coward and resume her performance...

What happened to any of the maren? Judging by cutscenes, theme seem to just disappear and the reappear in Wizeman's throne room, like when he destroys Donbalon.

When I played the game, I assumed Donbalon and Bomamba were not really in Wizeman's room, since NiGHTS had killed them; I thought they were just some kind of illusions, like holograms, fake bodies created by Wizeman to show Reala what had happened to them. He shows Bomamba falling, because that's how she died, and he crushes Donbalon in his hand, making him explode (because he's a balloon), which is similar to how Donbalon died (he exploded, though he was pierced instead of crushed).

[Rachell]

I think the last scene with NiGHTS on Bellbridge's tower was only symbolic (because he has nothing to do in the real world), something like "NiGHTS will always be in your heart".

which leads me to the question...does that have something to do with NiGHTS phrase "we will be friends forever?"

either he said that to keep the game kid friendly, or that phrase had a second meaning :/

[Lumas Nocce]

Okay, first things first, Will's dad is pedobear and he prolly turned the lights off to abduct the kiddlywinks. No, that's a lie, I kid the pedobear community.
I think the point of Wizey's death is that Will and Helen have resolved their problem, and so Wizeman's been eleiminated fro mtheir worlds. They've ridden themselves of their darkness. As such, they don't need NiGHTS anymore, and as such, he dissapears. Have any of you ever read Narnia? After Susan and Peter have learned whaterver silly religious morals they were supposed to learn from Aslan and their adventures, they can't come back anymore. I assume, y'know, that the kids won't be lucid dreaming anymore for a while, either.

Reala, like NiGHTS and Wizeman, is an essential part of humans' dreams, so... literally, he prolly just fell to the ground. Maybe he 'sploded, but, being a nightmare made of fear and tears and whatnot, he'll probably just regenerate when there's enough of that in someother kids SOULS... same as NiGHTS....

[Nessa Mouse]

Wizeman not being dead? Possible for the same reason NiGHTS and Reala might still "Exist." My favorite author liked pointing out the power of belief in his books. Ever read Terry Pratchet's "Small Gods?" It shows a theory that we don't exist because of Gods, Gods exist because of our belief fueling them. The same could be said of Will and Helen's Ideya. In the false ending Will and Helen wake up, smile and stretch with a "Oh, what a fun dream look." on their faces. BUT. In the true ending they wake up crying because their friend is "Dead." Yet NiGHTS is seen alive and well. They believe he is real, and will him back into existance. Instead of Wizeman's powers keeping NiGHTS in existance, NiGHTS could be fueled by the Ideya willingly given up by Will and Helen. As well as any other visitor who has seen any of the Maren. It's pointed out somewhere (Don't remember where) that NiGHTS is attracted to visitors Ideya. Ideya seems to be willpower made into lifeforce in Nightopia. Any of the characters could be reformed the same way. When Wizeman says he can't be destroyed, he could have been tricking Helen and Will into keeping him alive by planting that little seed of doubt.

At least thats the theory me and the betrothed came up with. He won't play NiGHTS, says it looks too hard. But likes watching me play it.


As for Will and Helen's parents? They were probably just too surprised at the power outage to react quickly, not to mention the sudden appearance of snow. The whole ending seemed a tiny bit forced, anyway. Like the writers were at a complete loss on how to end it. And lets face it, the rest of the game was a LOT to live up too.

[Noctourne Wonderland]

I like the idea that NiGHTS and Wizey are only dead to the kids; obviously fear exsists in the world, but no longer does it plague the kiddies. In fact, it explains alot- NiGHTS appears at the end to show that there are still kids who need his help (sequel! sequel!), but to Will and Helen, his assitance in life is no longer important.

Will's dad as Pedobear? OFF TO PHOTOSHOP!

[InTheNightlight]

I personally think that Wizey's still out there, but he's gone to bother some other kids. NiGHTS, however, is only thought to be dead, yet we see him in his usual tippy-toe, flute-playing position on the tower. He isn't dead yet.

...That brings these ideas into my head.

Pian: Dearly beloved, we are gathered here today--
NiGHTS: I'M NOT DEAD YET! Lemme outta here! You sonofabiscuit!

And this...

Will or Helen: NiGHTS, you are dead to me.
NiGHTS: *goes to drown his sorrows in ice cream*

Back on topic, Wizey's alive, Reala's alive, NiGHTS is alive, Jackle is being held hostage by Octopaw, Puffy and Donbalon have 19 kids, Chamelan is being held hostage by Omochao, and SEGA is going to focus on Sonic for the next decade, then realese a NiGHTS 3, but people will hate it and this site shall cease to exist.

......Um, did I say that out loud? Never mind.

And the kids' parents do NOTHING because they were distracted by something shiny...or Will's dad is distracted by the rock that sent the soccer ball down the steps.

[Key-Chan]

Answer to all of these questions is.... their all in Plot Hole Land which is located in the Bermuda Triangle eating tacos and nachos with Blaze the Cat (since Sonic Team created a pretty BIG plot hole with her).

[Kentilan]

Come on, NiGHTS being dead or not has nothing to do with a plothole. It's more of a deliberate mystery left open to interpretation. Same for Wizeman.

[Key-Chan]

Meh, plot hole or not their all floting around somewhere right? But for now let`s just say NiGHTS along with everyone else is put back in that unused bin in the storage closet located in Sonic Teams office building and next to that bin is a row of other bins labeled: `Space Channel 5` `Jet Set Raidio` `Samba De Amigo` (I know about the Wii one but same as NiGHTS it only had two games) and `Ristar` just to name a few.