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#41
^_^ Go Dreamer

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Have you ever been laughed at on the court in front of a bunch of strangers because some fool just shook you up (basketball term #1) and broke your ankles (basketball term #2) ? Hell you'd go on a thousand journeys to make yourself forget the embarrassment. Claris had fear in her heart to go out on to an audition because she apparently has issues with being disapproved by people. Trust me. No one wants to go somewhere like Showtime at the Apollo or audition for American Idol (I hate that f**k*n show) and get totally ripped on and kicked out of the camera. I'd say NiD's theme (now I might be wrong here) was dealing with issues in society. The fear of not being accepted by people. This stuff often leads to school shootings and suicide a lot here in America.

The theme in JoD was of course family. As you said Will's dad left him and Helen drifted from her mom. It was a nice message but it really didn't feel too important to a lot of people. Now from a kid's perspective the story may have brought them closer to their parents but seriously the Wii as a system was designed to do that in the first place so it felt kinda useless (to me anyway) to try and further Nintendo's idea more than it needed to be. For an entire decade I didn't have my father with me all the time since my people's (that's parents for those that don't know) got a divorce and me and my sis lived with my mom until about four years ago when he came back. I never felt sad really maybe because he used to be a drunken bastard... okay I'm leaving the topic too much now. Basically to sum all of this up I could care less about tender family crap because I have too many issues with what goes on, on the streets in my city. But then again most of the crime that happens in the city happens from kids who's parents may be dead, or don't interact with them enough, or at all, or don't have a father figure or father figure, or a mother or a mother figure. Then again those kids are almost grown teens who know right from wrong but somehow find ways to justify their criminal intentions such as committing crimes to help their family.

DAMMIT WHY MUST BOTH GAME'S THEMES INTERACT WITH EACH OTHER!!!


I completely agree with you!

The Family theme in NJoD didn't appeal to me because my father was a heartless evil man, for what he did..... the neglect and abuse.. Along with us getting taken away from my mother.. I have a hatred for him! ^_^ But back on topic While JoD is an ok game that I love alot, I love NiD so much more because I can better relate to the feelings and fears that Claris and Elliot go through.

#42
Huruyami

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Well well, it seems as if I've gartered some attention around here. Never have I seen a topic move this fast.

Anyway, Purgatory, saying that they "force the game upon you" is not at all what I implied. But, I didn't expect you to catch it, so just sit there like a good little puppy. *pats you on zee head.*

#43
Purgatory

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Don't talk to me like that. Its not even cute.

Everyone stay on the topic.

#44
Musashi_HUmar

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I have to agree with everyone else. What made NiD so great was because the problems that Claris and Elliot had were problems kids that could relate to more. The whole point of the game was how a wonderful being called NiGHTS called on the 2 of them to save Nightopia. As a result of accomplishing something so great, the both of them gained a lot more confidence in themselves and were then able to succeed in conquering their problems.

#45
phosphorus

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here's my shortened opinion of JoD:

Imagine that NiD was a really old anime (Like Astro Boy old) JoD is like the game based on the remade, re imaged adaptation decayed anime. Iizuka just can't resist rebooting even continuity he gets his hands on ^_^ In my opinion, he's responsible for the unbelievable mess the Sonic continuity has become, because according to SEGA, it's ALL canon. Sure, back in the 90's, the TV shows were technically canon, but everyone just ignored them. (Sonic Adventure was a another reboot, IMO, then Sonic Adventure 2 introduced Shadow the Plot Tumor)


What's the story to JoD? if you read the manual, Wizeman's making trouble or something. But in game? As far as I can tell, the storyline doesn't go beyond "Reala picks on NiGHTS, then a while later, Wizeman grabs NiGHTS, and it's last level time."

That's way better than "NiGHTS helps Elliot and Claris conquer their fears, while they help NiGHTS conquer his own" [/sarcasm]

And the wii's explosively retarded analogue sticks make any game that relies on them being analogue worse.

I wish SEGA would at least make 3rd party controllers.

E: The best thing JoD did was teach me to appreciate Stick Canyon.

#46
Musashi_HUmar

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I hear ya, man! Granted, JoD did have some nice stuff, but it just doesn't beat the original! NiD=Win for so many reasons....

#47
trueBLUE

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JoD wasn't as horrid as people think, but I am going to put this in big bold letters to get my point across. Nintendo fanboy style.

This game was only a year in development. A year folks.

The stuff Iizuka put in JoD just boggles my mind. Why do we have a stupid story line that tries to jam morales down our throats (though for the benefit of the doubt, Mario Galaxy did this too, only it was OPTIONAL...>/)? Why did he replace the Ideya Capture missions with the Chase strucure, making lap replayability next to impossible when stage design was, in fact, quite excellent in some parts? Why the shoddy graphics when other games, despite Wii's underpowered engine (READ: VC releases, Zack and Wiki, Mario Galaxy) look wonderful? Why all the stupid mini-games (*coughplatformingcough*)? Sonic Team Syndrome folks, most amazing thing in the world.

Off topic (completely), I'm loving Yoshi's Story. I may be the only Nintendo fanboy that appreciates it. It's like NiGHTS, only: no flying, Yoshis, storybook setting, but it has the score attack feeling that NiD had.

NiD and Yoshi's Story, two games on two different consoles. Can't go wrong with them. =)

#48
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The stuff Iizuka put in JoD just boggles my mind. Why do we have a stupid story line that tries to jam morales down our throats (though for the benefit of the doubt, Mario Galaxy did this too, only it was OPTIONAL...>/)? Why did he replace the Ideya Capture missions with the Chase strucure, making lap replayability next to impossible when stage design was, in fact, quite excellent in some parts? Why the shoddy graphics when other games, despite Wii's underpowered engine (READ: VC releases, Zack and Wiki, Mario Galaxy) look wonderful? Why all the stupid mini-games (*coughplatformingcough*)? Sonic Team Syndrome folks, most amazing thing in the world.

Because George Bush doesn't care about black people.

#49
Purgatory

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Because George Bush doesn't care about black people.

LMAO you win! Its the entire reason why JoD is bad. XD

#50
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Oh god... Don't bring the president into this. Save that for a different topic.

#51
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I think that by putting in all the cutscenes and dialogue, and defining the characters and events more, they left less of the game to interpretation, which is what a lot of people liked about the original game. It allowed you to fill in the gaps using your imagination, which even gave it the almost 'dreamlike' quality. I think the original idea behind the first game was that the players themselves were supposed to put themselves in nights' shoes, and the new one is way less ambiguous.

But, that beind said, you can't really blame them. They were trying to improve the game, because the 'market' would indicate that the first game was not perfect. So they thought they were avoiding some of the mistakes made the first time around, and they knew it would be directed at a younger audience so they assumed they needed to explain it more. They just underestimated the quality and value of a game that lets you use your imagination, and with the ability and ease of putting in dialogue and custcenes now (something which would've made the game way overbudget back when the first one came out) they probably thought it was stupid to exclude something like that when almost all games nowadays have that stuff in it. They didn't want it to be missing anything "vital" in comparison to other games, but in doing so I think it actually took away from the ingeniousness of the original.

I guess that's just how the cookie crumbles. It's hard to say if it was better for them to change it to a more audience friendly game to try and sell it, or keep it the same for die hard fans, and I bet they mulled over that quite a bit themselves before they designed it. I guess they know that most die hard fans will give it a chance anyway, so they didn't have much to lose by trying to broaden horizons. Plus there's the ps2 remake, which I hear isn't as great as the original, but I guess that's kind of moot seeing how it's Japan-only.

#52
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I think that by putting in all the cutscenes and dialogue, and defining the characters and events more, they left less of the game to interpretation, which is what a lot of people liked about the original game. It allowed you to fill in the gaps using your imagination, which even gave it the almost 'dreamlike' quality. I think the original idea behind the first game was that the players themselves were supposed to put themselves in nights' shoes, and the new one is way less ambiguous.

But, that beind said, you can't really blame them. They were trying to improve the game, because the 'market' would indicate that the first game was not perfect. So they thought they were avoiding some of the mistakes made the first time around, and they knew it would be directed at a younger audience so they assumed they needed to explain it more. They just underestimated the quality and value of a game that lets you use your imagination, and with the ability and ease of putting in dialogue and custcenes now (something which would've made the game way overbudget back when the first one came out) they probably thought it was stupid to exclude something like that when almost all games nowadays have that stuff in it. They didn't want it to be missing anything "vital" in comparison to other games, but in doing so I think it actually took away from the ingeniousness of the original.

I guess that's just how the cookie crumbles. It's hard to say if it was better for them to change it to a more audience friendly game to try and sell it, or keep it the same for die hard fans, and I bet they mulled over that quite a bit themselves before they designed it. I guess they know that most die hard fans will give it a chance anyway, so they didn't have much to lose by trying to broaden horizons. Plus there's the ps2 remake, which I hear isn't as great as the original, but I guess that's kind of moot seeing how it's Japan-only.



For what itsd worth, the Ps2 remake of niGHTs actually sold worse than NJOD so the changes did appeal to more people overall. At least 15k in Japan and 60k in the Us. Definitely a lfop but the Ps2 one in Japan sold about 3000.

#53
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For what itsd worth, the Ps2 remake of niGHTs actually sold worse than NJOD so the changes did appeal to more people overall. At least 15k in Japan and 60k in the Us. Definitely a lfop but the Ps2 one in Japan sold about 3000.

Had it been released worldwide I think it'd have made far more. Far, far more. It was a huge mistake on SEGA's part to release it on one littlebig island.

#54
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May I ask a question?

These ideas; were they inspired by someone else's?

No offense, I just hear a lot of the same; the only NiGHTS fan who I've heard original reasons from is, quite frankly, my girlfriend. And she liked it at first, a lot of things made her dislike it after awhile, but now she's 50/50 about it after trying it; just like myself. Everything else I hear sounds copypasta; excluding from TRiPPY or admins and a few select others. Again; no offense, it's just I caught one person spreading false rumors about the game nearly a year ago, and she told me she'd only take it down if I would hear her out over a giant rant over one of the admins; which sounded staged and copy & pasted. After I replied to her, she never replied back to this very day after I proved her wrong over everything she said was wrong about said admin. I won't name names of either of the two, and, for those of you who still remember me, I'm neutral on everything related to the fandom. you know what i mean.

If you would like to know more, PM me. It's taken care of, but I'm happy to talk about it as long as it doesn't get too drama-oriented. It probably wouldn't be of harm to the board, but if admins/mods need to know what happened, or need to warn me about my little rant over here, you're welcome to :3.

I happen to be thankful, however, that I'm not the only NiGHTS fan who can't urge him or herself to pick it up and play it. I did like it, but never as much as the original.

A remake, like Japan got, is what we all wanted deep down.

#55
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Sega didn't do that badly on JoD. Sure, the cutscenes looked horrible, but that shouldn't take away from the gameplay itself, right? Once I played NiD, I found that I missed being able to go around for extra laps in the new game. While not as springy-feeling as NiD, the Nunchuk controls in JoD were fine once I rounded out the hole. I really can't decide which game I like better. The new one allows for more mistakes because it takes a whole 2 seconds to break a link while the first one cut you off right after 1. Since I stink at videogames in general, I like the 2-second system. I don't like in NiD how easy it is to kill the Nightopians. I will be absent-mindedly paralooping some blue chips, hear a little chirp in the back of my mind, and by the time I realize that sound is a Nightopian in the vicinity it's already giving its dying scream. Then I feel so bad. On the other hand, though, the change of the paraloop from a deadly weapon to a transporting device in JoD makes it seem way less potent and impressive. The voices in JoD actually impressed me, as horrible as they sounded. The mouth movements and the dialogue matched, which is more than a lot of videogames can say.

So, I guess my point is that JoD wasn't totally ruined. It has its good and bad points just like NiD. I honestly think it was the quick release that hurt it more than Iizuka.

#56
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I just know how manipulative things can be in the community.

. . .
NO sh!t, SON

A lot of communities are. I had a fallout with this one, which I still have intact and probably will reactivate in a matter of weeks. It always feels like a home to me, deep down, though. Why? Because it's a friendly environment with rare amounts of trolling and generally friendly people, plus I always have and will remain interested in NiD.

Honestly. Name one time, ONE TIME, that ANY mod insulted you and totally gutted you for no apparent reason (oh, and the last board doesn't count); and trust me, things are always kept nice when they need to. I know for a fact that the mods are active and never rude and etc when it isn't necessary. You don't have to like this community, but if you don't you don't have to complain about it on it. If you don't like how it's run, you don't have to stay.

Sorry for the rant here; probably should've kept it to a PM >>;. I'm, once again, completely tired of the lack of originality created in mudslinging; it's not funny anymore. My GOD, if you're gonna mudsling be original i.e. lurk moar. Ah well, like anyone takes you seriously :lol:.

Back on topic.:

I like what TRAViS said.

I feel JoD is ok, but there's a steep hill of things you need to go over.

BTW I think Naka made as much of a difference to NiD and JoD as the change in actors of Wedge Antilles at the end of Star Wars IV. Slight difference, but it doesn't matter much except to the fans; who have a right to believe so if they want to.

Like it does anyway.

edit - not to escape the fury of the mods, but i'm not say the mods and admins try to manipulate others up above.

Whether I do or don't is my opinion and I shall not share it with anyone except those I trust :)

Like I even have an opinion on it. I could care less :D. Drama is so overrated.




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